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All Things 223AI

Dan In Alaska

Well-known member
Nov 30, 2007
3,366
64
Anchorage
Here's another one:


700, Jewel trigger, PN 3-groove @ 22", 1-8 Twist, varmint contour, A5 w/ Williams ADL trigger guard, extended mag box, VX-II 6-18x w/ turret treatment.

I've mainly been shooting fireform loads (27.5gr H335 w/ 50gr V-Max's). I've got a decent supply of brass now, so I'll start sticking them together with some 75's.
 

GeorgeS3

Well-known member
Nov 30, 2007
762
0
Good ole Louisiana
"Candy"---a 700 sucks, PN 1@22" 1-8 twist, adl, Mickey classic, Leupy 3.5x10-40, Talley Allies

"Chinky chunk"--700 sucks, A5, Leupy 3.5x10-40 M1, Talley Allies, more details later

Gotta VSSF 700 already punched, an LTR and an LVSF (both in Mickeys) waitin to be punched.....

George
 

darrenk75b

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2009
204
2
Norcal
.223 AI Chunk
Trued Remmy action, Shilen #7 at 21", Manners T4



Halibut
Trued Remmy action, Brux #3 at 21", McMillan Classic
 

Nail

Well-known member
Feb 8, 2008
778
5
48
Mississippi
Shankenstein
223AI
Rem.700 SA
P/N 8-twist, 3-groove, Lilja #7, 22"
GAP A5, sniper fill, BDL
VX-III 3.5-10X40
Talley LW lows
RB Trigger
Callahan Speedlock FP

 

RickF

Well-known member
Jun 4, 2008
435
4
East Kootenays, BC
M700 short action with a PN #1 contour, 8 twist, 3 groove, super match 22 1/2" barrel. McMillan standard fill compact stock with 40% purple / 40% light gray / 20% turquoise.

Floorboard crown, factory trigger tuned to a dead crisp 2 pounds, and old timey safety tab that locks the bolt down with the safety on. It has a Leupold Mark 2 3-9X40 Hunter with L.R. reticle sitting in Conetrol medium Custum rings. It balances between the lug and the front guard screw. It's a keeper!

 

Brad Arnett

Well-known member
Nov 17, 2007
799
0
Michigan
Big Stick said:
You boys are gonna talk me into building one of them there 223Arkies.................
You have no idea.....best check on the 'fire to find out what they can/can't do..... I read that Gene Ingram makes a good knife too....



That deer be leakin' around that HS mag.....just sayin...
 

Uncle Dave

Administrator
Nov 17, 2007
3,622
0
Just pulled Bill's 223AI out of the boat and stashed it. Shoulda grabbed a pic while I had it out...
 

Brad Arnett

Well-known member
Nov 17, 2007
799
0
Michigan
We'll be running 4 of them out to 1000yards again tomorrow.

We're taking a guy shooting with us who has never stretched out anything but want to give it a go. He's gunning a 308, which is his only rifle and all he knows. After he's had his fill with the 308 superseal and I are going to turn him loose with the 223AI's, 243AI's, and 6.5-284. It'll be interesting to see what his thoughts are when we're done for the day and empty brass is piled up....but I think I already know what he's gonna say.

I'm crossing my fingers and hoping for some wind.
 

SuperSeal110

Well-known member
Sep 18, 2008
273
0
Michigan
Trued SA 700
PacNor, super match, SS 1/8", 3 groove, PN LW con, finished @ 21"
McMillan Mnt rifle stock, ADL, Std fill, PN LW con. 50%blk50%org
Aluminum ADL trigger guard
Talley rings
Leupold 3.5-10, TT
Spiral fluted bolt by Karl
Shifter knob by Karl- kampfire knob




Trued SA 700
Schneider M24/M40, SS, 5 groove, 1/8", finished @ 22"
McMillan A5, forest camo
Badger M4 aluminum BM
Seekin's 20moa rail
Seekin's 30mm lows
Junk force 3.5-15*50 NPR1
Eagle stock pack- woodland


Trued SA 700
Mike Rock, SS, 1/8", Rem Var con,finished @ 21"
McMillan A5, ADL, standard fill, Rem varmint con, 60%grape40%purple
Talley rings
Leupold 6.5-20*40 w/M1's
Spiral fluting by Karl
Shifter knob by Karl- kampfire knob
Graphite black cerakote
 

SuperSeal110

Well-known member
Sep 18, 2008
273
0
Michigan
Shot this 5 shot group at 1000yds yesterday. Prior to that, I was ringing steel at 500yds. My barrel was skillet when I shot this group at 1k. 31.75moa and was holding 1 mil windage.

Not an impressive group by no means, but it's fun running a pencil thin barrel out to 1k.

"You always want a Bull barrel."

 

Calvin

Well-known member
Nov 17, 2007
4,145
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Visit site
I took my 223AI shooting tonight, and it continues to impress.

SS 700 Action
23" Lilja 1-8 3 Groove #1
McM Mtn Rifle Stock, lug bedded.
RB Trigger
Tally Lwts
6x42 w/ Target Turrets

Went sub .5 tonight, with 75amax's. Rifle was a dream to load for, because it was stupid accurate with every load/bullet I tried.

Gonna hunt with for the rest of alpine season. Easily my favorite rifle, and I'm duping it in 25-06AI based on a Ti action.
 

Calvin

Well-known member
Nov 17, 2007
4,145
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Visit site
When do the bucks usually shed velvet? I'm ready to roll with the 75amax. Can't make any worse of a mess than the 162. I've got next week to hunt.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
The end of the 1st week of August,has them tattered,with some out. The end of the second,puts a guy in the Huckleberries and that's my favorite.

I'll have two weeks to connect and am liking the odds..............
 

secretsquirrel

Active member
Jan 31, 2009
26
0
my 223 ackley.
stiller predator, 8 twisted brux @ 23", Williams stainless oberndorf floorplate, Ed LaPour 3 pos shroud safety, rifle basix erv-3, mcmillan classic, loopy 3.5 x 10 x 40 cds, talleys.




excuse my shit camera and picture skills.
 

secretsquirrel

Active member
Jan 31, 2009
26
0
Haven't had a chance to shoot it yet, screwed the scope on yesterday but the magbox is opened to 2.6 and its throated for the 75 amax. i been payin attention.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
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Curious to hear how it all works out.

Need to get off my cunt,holster the fishing rods and mod the magbox on my Montucky 223AI and stretch her legs on some Venison..............
 

Ochoco

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
3,313
1
CO
Secretsquirrel said:
my 223 ackley.
stiller predator, 8 twisted brux @ 23", Williams stainless oberndorf floorplate, Ed LaPour 3 pos shroud safety, rifle basix erv-3, mcmillan classic, loopy 3.5 x 10 x 40 cds, talleys.




excuse my shit camera and picture skills.
I can dig that color scheme........Don't forget to report back on the second half of the fun.
 

Horse1

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2007
2,962
12
In the vicinity of dandihood
The Kreiger cleans very easily in just a few patches (no moly). The rifle shoots 75gn Berger VLD's better than A-max's but neither are as good as I was hoping. @ 300yds it'll run 3 or 4 into less than 2" and throw 1 or 2 making a 5 shot group open to 4"-5". Maddening when most go where there supposed to and the flyers are so far off the mark. I'm running nickle WW brass that I sorted by weight. I've got a bunch of Rem brass brass and I'll run some of that in the spring.

Off to load up the mutts and find a ruff or 2.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
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465
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I'm fairly anti-nickle,especially in bughole pursuits. I've some nice lots of W/W 223 hulls,but prefer R/P by about a jazillion.

Weather is nice enough,I should oughtta hang the feesh rods up and roll some shooting video. Need to fuck with the Montucky and should bang around my Beeg PN A2 and the 1-14" Hart Big And Pink/Full Of Stink.

Then do shit that can't be did,with Sporty Spice...................
 

darrenk75b

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2009
204
2
Norcal
Just sent off my chunk to the cave for a barrel install. I'll post pics upon its return

Rem 700 stainless SA
Pacnor 1:8 Rem varmint at 21" (I made an ordering mistake and got a 5-groove. Oh well, we'll see how she runs)
McMillan A5
Leupy 3.5-10x40 I have sitting here

Should compliment my Halibut nicely
 

wolfman

Well-known member
Mar 25, 2009
1,033
11
NB, Canuckistan

untouched 700 SA
calahan pin assey.
#3 Rock 5R @22"
Ti takeoff
3.5-10 W/ M1 up turret
talleys

trigger needs a tweak, but throws 62 tsx and 75 amax to the same spot at 100... I figured the barrel might be a bit much for the handle, but it balances just fine.
 

wolfman

Well-known member
Mar 25, 2009
1,033
11
NB, Canuckistan
I'm liking it so far. Will run it for the fall to see if the love holds, and then dupe/modify in .280 AI. Just scored a matte 6X to see what the fuss is all about.
 

ridgeline

Well-known member
Mar 22, 2009
662
7
australia
Trued 700 SA 223 AI
#2 pacnor 3 Groove 1-8" @ 22" 1" Shank
Ti Saum takeoff adl
Devcon snugged lug
Talley lw lows
Leupy 6x42 M1 up turret
2LB crisp sucks trigger
Moly/Kiss 75 Amax
Balances perfect shoots like a dirty lil bastid..

 

darrenk75b

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2009
204
2
Norcal
Barreled action showed up today from the cave. Immediately after I checked my email to see notification that the McMillan stock I had on order is ready. Should be a fun Thanksgiving!
 

darrenk75b

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2009
204
2
Norcal
New stock arrived, along with my action from the bat cave. Quickly coated the action in Alumahyde. I hate that crap, and will soon recoat in Moly Resin.

 

supermax

Member
Sep 26, 2010
22
0
well, I came home from a gunshow today with a B prefix 700 BDL Sporter in 223 with the barrel cropped to 22".......thinking of going down the 223AI road with it....again....been there, done that..but I ALWAYS had feeding problems with 700's in 223AI, had three of them........but, it's only a factory tube and I do my own chambers so there aint much to lose...will keep you posted...but,,...then again, I looked in my parts pile and I have a nearly new take off 223 barrel from a VLS,...and a PSS stock...maybe I should go that route...but, I already have a heavy stainless 223 in a VLS stock...decisons,...decisions....
 

go ahead

Well-known member
Jul 22, 2008
927
2
TN
How much up do u typically have left with talleys and say a 3.5-10 w/ M1's? Got the chunk in the works just aint sure how to mount the scope?
 

supermax

Member
Sep 26, 2010
22
0
I was considering AI'ing a 700 in 223 that I just picked up,...then I found this in the safe...what to do?....:)


 

pacecars

Well-known member
Dec 8, 2007
216
0
Flatwoods of N Fl
ridgeline said:
Trued 700 SA 223 AI
#2 pacnor 3 Groove 1-8" @ 22" 1" Shank
Ti Saum takeoff adl
Devcon snugged lug
Talley lw lows
Leupy 6x42 M1 up turret
2LB crisp sucks trigger
Moly/Kiss 75 Amax
Balances perfect shoots like a dirty lil bastid..

That has got to be one of the best looking rigs I have seen!
 

ridgeline

Well-known member
Mar 22, 2009
662
7
australia
Thanks Pacecars. Ti's a killer little rig fo sure.

Gotta classic Swirly inbound for it, should be here later this month. I love the Rem Classic ergos, will salt away the Ti for another project....
 

go ahead

Well-known member
Jul 22, 2008
927
2
TN
Sorry....it's just a trued up remmy with a Pac Nor super match 8 twist. Barrel cut at 21 3/4". Course it's a A5 standard fill. Runnin factory trigger for now along w talleys for now. Will add some Seekins rings and what not as funds allow. Scope is a 3.5-10 tactical.

Blew my mind how well it balances!!! Sweeet blueprint. Thank to all the guys here who told me how to build it.
 

go ahead

Well-known member
Jul 22, 2008
927
2
TN
Formin brass now. Have no idea about group sizes but you load 26.5gr of 335 and a vmax and u can't miss at 3oo.
 

erickg

Well-known member
Aug 14, 2011
145
0
Going to have PT&G build me a reamer, is there any need to send them a dummy round or do they have the 75 amax seated long figured out by now?
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
The 75A-Max is seated "long" in a SAAMI throat.

A 2.450" COAL kiss to same,will always put you in friendly territory...though I've got 'em longer and shorter both..................
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
Midsouth and Midway,routinely stock Vanilla Redding 223AI FL dies...but you might could waiting on the bushing versions..............
 

16Bore

Well-known member
Feb 11, 2010
3,272
1
Virgina
So......

Keep me from fucking this up. I'm going SS 1:8 Douglas at 23", Remmy varmint contour. My mag box allows me 2.385 COAL with 75's. Leave it as is or fuck with the spacer to get 2.450? Pretty much set on 53's and 75's for fodder.....
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
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Slide the spacer to allow feed/function of a kissing 75'Max and pad that dimension enough to chase the throat.

Where are you at on the project? What stock? I'd want far less than a VS contour as an All Arounder,could suffer 23",though I prefer 21".

Light done right,cain't be trumped for either Fun or Utility...................
 

16Bore

Well-known member
Feb 11, 2010
3,272
1
Virgina
Shoulda said "if" I go Douglas, but anyway.....

This project is at the "do I wanna drop 5 bills on this shit" stage. Currently it sits in a jimmyfucked kryloned HS Varmint stock that I've taken a liking to. It's solely a shits and giggles paper punching unit. I like the 53's and 500yds is all the play room I've got. Biggest gain with 75's would be about a 9" difference in drift.
 

darrenk75b

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2009
204
2
Norcal
If you want a piece of aluminum to fit in the back of your mag box to allow longer COAL, shoot me a PM with your address. I've still got plenty.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
16Bore said:
Shoulda said "if" I go Douglas, but anyway.....

This project is at the "do I wanna drop 5 bills on this shit" stage. Currently it sits in a jimmyfucked kryloned HS Varmint stock that I've taken a liking to. It's solely a shits and giggles paper punching unit. I like the 53's and 500yds is all the play room I've got. Biggest gain with 75's would be about a 9" difference in drift.
I'd greedily grab Douglas over Shilen,though Hart by a mile over both and PN remains my flavorite by goodly margin. 1-8" is where it's at. I prefer 75'Max from the muzzle,to their transonic slip...over all other entries. They just fucking flat fuck shit up and slip conditions in sinister fashion.

Having done did the HS V handle and the VS contour in 223AI,many moons ago and reflecting upon all the water under that bridge,there's zero fucking chance I'd not go Faux Ti instead.

Hint..................(grin)
 

16Bore

Well-known member
Feb 11, 2010
3,272
1
Virgina
Im diggin the shit outta my Faux 260. If somebody fucked up and sold a take-off, I could see going that route again. VA say's these won't kill deer, so I'm fucked in that department. As it sits, accuracy has been shit with 40's, 45's 50's, 52's, 53's, 55's, and 60's. Even ran some 68's and got to see how bullets could fly sideways.

Best part of this POS is Chad did a good job swirling the bolt...
 

high country

Active member
May 11, 2012
27
0
Well my reamer showed up today.......and its match, not improved.....Dammit. I hope davester has my reamer in the shop still.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
16Bore said:
Im diggin the shit outta my Faux 260. If somebody fucked up and sold a take-off, I could see going that route again. VA say's these won't kill deer, so I'm fucked in that department. As it sits, accuracy has been shit with 40's, 45's 50's, 52's, 53's, 55's, and 60's. Even ran some 68's and got to see how bullets could fly sideways.

Best part of this POS is Chad did a good job swirling the bolt...
Tough to trump: Kiss,find pressure and rocking on...no matter the chambering.

I've yet to see a "bad" Remmie in any chambering,let alone 223. Though I've seen more than a few,brandished as "not shooting" and all was operator error +P++. The usual culprits are glass,bases,rings and receiver fasteners,though in no particular order. On the average,pussy torque dooms alotta sound rifles,as do dead-headed screws butting the bolt and barrel shank.

Few are as take-off hip as I,but in considering an OEM .378 boltface platform,I'll happily pass on their offerings. 1-9" is a borderline twist rate and I'd not yerk an OEM slower twist spout,to brandish same. 'Course I've got a Big Green 1-9" 223AI 20" LTR that sling 75 A-Max exceptionally...but would not bet my balls on a repeat performance. Long story short,1-8" is where it's at and I doubt that'd be a "secret".

Trip the HS handle and issued spout,score a Ti stock and a 1-8" spout of repute. You'll be into the upgrade for modest loot and the first outing will have you freaking the fuck out in it's inherent abilities.

Have the shank stamped "243Win",if only to fuck with heads....................(grin)
 

16Bore

Well-known member
Feb 11, 2010
3,272
1
Virgina
I like chasing tail, but not my own. I hate to admit I mounted those pigs about 7 years ago.....

points for the macro G-12 shot
 

high country

Active member
May 11, 2012
27
0
Here is a simple setup I use to verify my bedding work, and it does a stellar job in proving soundness of mounting as well.....just move it to the scope/action.



And to save stick the opportunity to jab at the barrel gutters......twernt mine.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
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16Bore said:
I like chasing tail, but not my own. I hate to admit I mounted those pigs about 7 years ago.....

points for the macro G-12 shot
That's why I LOVE used rifles that "don't shoot"..............(grin)
 

16Bore

Well-known member
Feb 11, 2010
3,272
1
Virgina
Best BC you can get for a slow twist barrel. I think the 75's will get you about 10" less drift at the 500 yd line assuming 10mph crosswind. Haven't run them past 100yds yet as my 223 has been acting like a bitch....
 

okbow87

Well-known member
Jan 2, 2013
133
0
OKC, OK
Yes v-max. I know there is really no reason to run them over the 75's if you have a fast enough twist. Just thought I would see if anybody really liked them for one reason or another.
 

nimrod1949

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2010
329
37
n. idaho
Build list:
SS Sucks Action
#2 1:8 Rock Creek Barrel 3/4" shank
PTG one piece bolt, shroud, pin, & ADL trigger guard
HTS/Bansner Stock
old style 700 trigger
topped with Talleys and a 3.5-10 Leupold

Weighs in at 7# 5oz
Work done by IT&D

 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
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Looks like you gotcha' a low bridge,if that erector is anywhere close to a 250yd zero as illustrated. Nice to have 35MOA on tap,after the zero.

Light done right,ain't got no equal and you is there.................
 

Supper

Well-known member
Jun 2, 2008
471
0
WY/UT
Is it feasible to launch the 90 VLD's w/ a .223AI or is that more suited to its bigger brother the .22-250AI? Should a person plan on the 1:7 that Berger recommends, or... ?
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
I've not shot 90's,so cain't comment. Just tried to order a can of 'em from their site,but they are out.

I'd try 'em in my 1-7.7" 22-250AI Krieger,to see WTF................
 

16Bore

Well-known member
Feb 11, 2010
3,272
1
Virgina
So finally decided to pull the trigger on my 2013 project. Going with a 1:8 LVSF dupe sans flutes in a SAUM take off. Planning for a 2.450 75 Amax kiss, which I think is the general consensuses of where shit should be. After fucking with the 75 dummy, it looks like a 50 VMax kiss is 2.285. Obviously it might be a little different once its said and done, but do those numbers sound about right?
 

16Bore

Well-known member
Feb 11, 2010
3,272
1
Virgina
Going 22" SS Douglas 1:8 LVSF dupe to ride in the SAUM Ti takeoff. Had planned a Sporter/Ti at first, but the SAUM showed up, so fuck it....
 

shortactionsmoke

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2013
311
0
Grindstone Hill
My 223AI is a 1:8 Douglas too. I went sporter contour, 23". It shoots GOOD. I'm currently waiting on the McMillan.

I'm keeping my eyes open for another donor. I want a light one for my 9 year old daughter.
 

Rman

Well-known member
Jun 4, 2008
955
1
Calgary, Canada
My reamer just showed up on Friday. Waiting on the donor to get here. I went with a 7 twist Kreiger, Remmy Varmint contour. I think I'll go long at 24".

R.
 

RTA48

Well-known member
Jan 29, 2013
109
0
Houston
anyone have a couple of 75 gr. A-Max'd they could spare? I am trying to put together a couple of dummies to share with my smith.

Thanks,

Randy
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
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What rifle? What boolits you got on hand? I can extrapolate their kiss,to a 75's COAL...which will of course exact like throat dimensions...............
 

Rman

Well-known member
Jun 4, 2008
955
1
Calgary, Canada
I'm sure its been axed, but fucked if I can find it...

What bushing for the .223AI, 75 A-max, Moly, and R-P fire formed brass?
Sitting at .247 with the seated bullet.

Thanks!

R.
 

ridgeline

Well-known member
Mar 22, 2009
662
7
australia
Rman. A bushing at .244" will grant you the requisite .003 neck constriction with your Moly'd boolits. .244 + .003= .247
 

eddybo

Well-known member
Mar 4, 2011
182
0
Supper said:
Is it feasible to launch the 90 VLD's w/ a .223AI or is that more suited to its bigger brother the .22-250AI? Should a person plan on the 1:7 that Berger recommends, or... ?
Go 1-7. My nephew launches moly 90s out of his F-class rifle I helped him build. He has not got to shoot but one match due to scheduling conflicts with his mom's visitation or my being busy or sick. He did shoot a sub MOA 600 yard 20 shot group using lapua brass and N133, with way max charges. I think his velocity was in the 2920 range IIRC.
 

30338

Well-known member
Apr 3, 2010
576
48
So if a guy duped Candy from the first page of this thread, would he be missing much?
 

30338

Well-known member
Apr 3, 2010
576
48
Take a while to get the rest of components but will set my sights on something very close to that. Maybe 75 amax will be back by then....
 

30338

Well-known member
Apr 3, 2010
576
48
George, any idea on weight in the swirly stocked one? Mine is a lefty and came with a Tubbs firing pin. It has Leupold Mark 4 base and rings but thinking I want to go Talley lights and a VX3 on it.

Stick, appreciate all the info that you have posted regarding them. Even my old smith Dan Dowling is quite high on the 223ai. Just took me a while to find the lefty donor.
 

30338

Well-known member
Apr 3, 2010
576
48
Okay, parts list to date:

Lefty Rem SPS action and bottom metal $225
Bansner stock with sporter barrel channel $150(couldn't pass that up)
Looking to order #1 or mtn contour pacnor in 8 twist, 3 groove.

Since Bansner came with bdl inlet, going to have to stick with that. So my question is just run cheap sps bottom metal and box, or is there an aftermarket mag floorplate combo that works better?

Trying to stay cheap on this one with 2 kids in college next year.
 

30338

Well-known member
Apr 3, 2010
576
48
Internet surfed this one and looks like the sps bdl metal will stay. Just need a barrel and a smith at this point.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
Talk is cheap and all I can afford with this part time work and the "dreaded" expenses of milk & bread..............
 

raghornjp

Well-known member
May 4, 2010
4,649
97
A whole nuther country
Just remember imagination is free and can take you places that you could never go.

Maybe one day you'll get lucky enough to land a "full time" job.

Looking forward to that "expense" myself............
 

nimrod1949

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2010
329
37
n. idaho




Let a friend shoot his deer with my 223 last year so he naturally had to have one. I helped him put this together this fall.

Rem 700 CM action
IT&D installed Douglas 1:8 twist in Rem mountain contour at 21"
Bolt lugs lapped and action face squared
Hightech Specialties stock ADL
PTG trigger guard
 

Pat85

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2015
401
2
Pa.
Hello, figured I would post my AI questions over here rather on 24. Put together a 223 AI on a Borden action and Douglas 8 twist ss. COAL after touching the lands with the 75 amax 2.485, won't fit in the Remington mag box. Question, is the Coal a little long? It headspaced in tolerance with the gauges, favoring the high end of tolerance. What is the inside deminsion of a Remington mag box with the spacer? The one I have seems to have been adjusted quite a bit. Or should I just modify a new spacer to work and not worry about it.
 

J-Hon

Administrator
Dec 11, 2007
582
4
Northern Ky
No, sounds like you are right on the money.

To shoot the 223AI/75 amax combo with factory remington bottom metal (magbox), you will need to reduce the magazine spacer. A million ways to do that, a search should yield you a smattering of them.

Most magazines end up in the 2.5/2.55" range after modification.....
 

Pat85

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2015
401
2
Pa.
That's what we will do then. Ordered a new Remington stainless mag box, will modify the spacer when it comes.
 

Pat85

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2015
401
2
Pa.

Borden Alpine
McMillan hunter
Douglas #2 stainless
PTG Oberndorf bottom metal
Fixed six super chicken with Talleys.
Jewel trigger
 

Pat85

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2015
401
2
Pa.








I built this thing in my shop. Borden rifles is only an hour and a half north of me so when I got the wild hair up my ass to try a custom action I went local. The first 20 rounds out it were in 5 shot groups around an inch + or- so it's needs tweaking. Some of it could be the Knucklehead pulling the trigger also. :D
 

Pat85

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2015
401
2
Pa.
Modified the spacer for the 75 a-max.

Cycled 5 rounds through without a hitch.

Appears to like 25 grains of Varget.


Any other load suggestions ?
 

Brazo

Well-known member
Mar 29, 2013
525
3
The Keystone State
Really well done, I could hunt year round with that rifle in a heartbeat. Great job, thanks again for the pics. I don't shoot a 223 AI, just my Kimber 223 but I have notes on 223 AI loads that I recorded from other members if you would like me to send it to you.
 

Pat85

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2015
401
2
Pa.
Worked my way up to 26 with h335, can't break moa with the h335. But the lever.
[img:center]http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8701/17012813652_8e03d9c563.jpg[/img]
[img:center]http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8724/16988266896_5ea201570d.jpg[/img]

I knew I lost one in that 300 yard group, assuming it was the flyer. I'am liking this setup more every time I shoot it. I can see some 30 cals. being thinned from the herd in the near future, a few vari x rulepolds also.
 

Pat85

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2015
401
2
Pa.
Brazo said:
I have notes on 223 AI loads that I recorded from other members if you would like me to send it to you.
Please do, I would greatly appreciate it.
 

go ahead

Well-known member
Jul 22, 2008
927
2
TN
I'm going to order an bushing sizing die. I am curious if their is a certain bushing that seems to work best with Daves reamer?

I screwed up stuck a case a bent the rod. Figured it was a good enough excuse to upgrade to a bushing die. Thanks
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
Bushings are sorted by brass thickness/consistency...NOT chambers.

If you've a rather excellent lot of uniform brass,then certainly opt a bushing die.

If not.

Do NOT...................
 

go ahead

Well-known member
Jul 22, 2008
927
2
TN
Thank you very much. So would the bushing that comes in the bushing die be standard size like a non bushing die? Only reason I ask is I was going to go on a get it while broke down....unless it's a bad idea.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
There is no bushing shipped with the bushing sizing die,because the Manufacturer has NO fucking idea what grass you are going to use.

To choose a bushing,measure a loaded round's neck diameter and subtract .003" and order a bushing of that diameter( I like mine TiN coated). I gun .003" constriction on everything,as I gun moly.

If your brass thickness varies,you'll obviously need different bushing diameters to do the different brass proud.

Long way of sayin',bushing dies fuck most folks wayyyyyyyyyy up,as it isn't a Cure-All.

Hint..............
 

Pat85

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2015
401
2
Pa.
Was banging bottles at 866 yards with the AI yesterday. 27.8 grains of Lever was giving me 5 shot groups you could cover with a nickel. 10 shots thru the crono was averaging 3175 fps. That fuckin Jewel trigger! 2/3 way through a box it started going off when I take it off safe. Took it out the stock, flushed it with lighter fluid reset every thing. It took care of the problem for another 50 rounds but I don't trust it anymore. I find it hard to believe they are that touchy, a little dust kicks up and your out of service. Might have just got a bad one but it has to come off, can't take any chances with it.
 

Pat85

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2015
401
2
Pa.
When we were kids we used to walk over there to shoot bottles with the >22s


Dialed in on the reflections on that cinder pile and took some of the bright ones out.
 

Pat85

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2015
401
2
Pa.
Driftin' said:
Pat85 said:
Was banging bottles at 866 yards with the AI yesterday....
That cain't be did with a fixed 6X!

*grin*
It did, now it took me 4-5 shots to take one out. The misses though were very close, they were either slightly left or right trying to figure the wind. Elevations were right on. Cranked it back to zero and its back in the cork at 100. Its a fun setup to shoot.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
Had BB-Gun's 6x MQ out yesterday on his PSA Garage Gun and whirled it up and down as fast as I could both ways,then tossed it back to him and told him "show me where your zero is at"...which plum fucked him up.

I then returned it to his 200yd zero,had him shoot a confirmation poke...then flunged him a zero stop so he'd never have that look on his face again. He soon had the erector out balls deep,making empties,dazzling himself at 1K ++.

I created a Monster.(grin)

Now we need to slow down,hack his front sight off,chop the sling swivel off the gas block,drill/install a swivel stud on the FF tube,then shorten the loudener and turn it into a thread protector.

Shit be coming along....................
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
Any of you guys buy a reamer for the .223AI? I can see I'm gonna build more and thinking it would be a great way to assure happiness. Not gonna go PTG on anything after last time. JGS any good?
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
Nothing was wrong with the reamer (that I know of at this point) but things didn't seem right the way they handled my order. Screwed it up enough to make me nervous about their focus on precision.

The fact that the ADL trigger guard sucked but had "NO RETURNS ON TRIGGER GUARDS" written on the receipt didn't help either.
 

Pat85

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2015
401
2
Pa.
I take issue with their shipping. Order gages and a reamer, they ship the gages in stock then ship the reamer after it comes off back order. Charge shipping both times, tell them to ship all together but they don't listen.
 

Oatmealsavage82

Well-known member
Nov 15, 2011
1,208
52
Alberta Canada
I've had quite a few ptg reamers that don't cut worth a damn, know a few other guys that have got out of spec reamers. The tales of their qc not being what it used to are not unfounded. It's really too bad because they make some really cool products.
 

Pat85

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2015
401
2
Pa.
Oatmealsavage82 said:
I've had quite a few ptg reamers that don't cut worth a damn,
Have one of their reamers that don't cut, no matter what rpm it would chatter. Had some issues with hard spots in this last barrel but the PTG reamer cut right through it and produced a nice chamber.
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
Anybody have a handle on how much free bore translates to kissing lands with a 75 Amax?
 

Spencer SS

Well-known member
Dec 5, 2007
956
0
da Bayou state
I'm thinking I'll try a 75amax spitter. 700, 18" threaded 5/8x24 (so it's the same as everything else I'll be running the Omega on), sitting in an MDT LSS.

Thoughts on tube contour?
 

Dude270

Well-known member
Dec 23, 2014
971
73
either are fine barrels, along with a lot of others. what was in stock would be a primary factor in my decision
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
PN remains my All Time favorite,but with Greg in the mix,it is tough to order ad wait...when I can call and have one in minutes. I have Greg mail it to my Plumber,it generally only takes a day to build and I'm right back in the saddle.

I've some dirty good Hart spouts and think highly of them too,were one inclined to order and wait..............
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
Nigger Buggy just swung by and was bragging up his latest Donkey Dick 223AI(700 based/Mike Rock Quick Spout and 75's).

I'm kinda setting the stage for my Donkey Dick 1-7.75" 270 with 105's...but will throw a coupla High RPM 223AI's in the crummy,for tomorrow's jaunt...............
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
Ordered a Micky for my next .223AI build. Went McMillan Hunter in Edge with PTG Stealth DBM. Ordered for sporter contour as that'll let me shoot the donor for a while but I'd like to go PacNor #2 with about an inch of shank if it wouldn't look too weird. Planning on 20-21". It's gonna ride in the truck so I might end up at 18" when all is said and done.

I keep thinking that 6x45 with an 18" would be pretty bad ass, but dangit I sure love the .223AI's versatility.

What magazines should I be scooping?
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
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I was just talking to Painless about this in a PM(DBM's). The Stealth is a good move and it ships with pillars to index ride height geometry,in relation to the bolt's nose. I prefer to use a lesser OD pillar and simply make my own,replicating PT&G's length. That goes DOUBLY so for a tender EDGE,because you'll not want holes of that diameter in 'er.

A 18" 270 1-8" or better,is a purty good time and a fuck of a LOT more quiet. You gotta put more English on 'em,due the discrepancy in 75 and 105 Launch Speeds,but the 105 is a fucking hammer in distant zipcodes.

The 223AI easily remains my favorite chambering of All Time................
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
Honestly, the quiet part along with the 18" has me pretty horned up.

I wonder if McMillan will hook me up on the pillars since I ordered the bottom metal from them as well?
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
Call and talk to them,relate exactly what you want and more importantly DON'T want.(grin)

I'd be surprised,if they couldn't easily hook you up...................
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
Called them today and all is in order. Accept for they don't carry PTG bottom metal anymore so I'll have to get it somewhere else. Not looking forward to dealing directly with PTG again, but Midway is $50 more...
 

Dude270

Well-known member
Dec 23, 2014
971
73
http://www.milehighshooting.com/remington-700-short-action-sa-colt-cooper-m5-detachable-mag-bottom-metal-dbm/
 

longdog

Well-known member
Nov 16, 2014
119
0
I ordered a stealth dBm and a couple magazines direct from ptg a few weeks ago. When I ordered, it indicated that not all was "in stock," but it all came in the mail, together, 4 days later. That's my own recent experience...
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
I confirm availability on everything ala telephone,through every Vendor...before I pull the trigger.

Also hash out shipping...............
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
How fast are you guys pushing 75 Amax with Lever?

I was running 3,183 with 28 grains but blew a few primers with naked bullets.

Backed off to 3,150 with 27.8 grains and things were good.

Added HBN and the 28 grain load is down to 3,117 so I'm gonna add more powder until I'm seeing 3,150 again and see how things go. Just curious as to where you guys are seeing pressure.
 

Dude270

Well-known member
Dec 23, 2014
971
73
I shoot 28 grains and get 3175 from a 23" barrel. Naked bullets. Primers are flat but I haven't popped any even in 85 to 90 degree heat.
 

longdog

Well-known member
Nov 16, 2014
119
0
22", 27.9 gr, naked, 3160. No issues in temps from -20 through 85. I'd like to moly or hbn, just haven't gotten up the ambition, yet. Too much to do, and not enough time.
 

Pat85

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2015
401
2
Pa.
27.8 gives me 3175 out of a 24" barrel. Got sprayed from a few primers letting loose in the nosler brass. Scraped the nosler brass and switched to rp and no issues with loose primer pockets anymore.
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
.223ai 75 Amax Lever Hex 70*

28 gr 3,117
28.2 gr 3,133
28.4 gr 3,160
28.6 gr 3,183
28.8 gr 3,196 sticky lift
 

Painless

Administrator
Finally got my heavy Skull fucked 223AI inletted for the Stealth DBM. Worked my dremel magic and things be shining brightly. Damn thing feeds like a fat baby. Went MDT 10 rounder and am liking the extry pokes as I won't be getting overrun by anything. Gonna order a couple more of the DBM's for future builds and a couple more mags to make it more unfair. Appreciate the shove on that one fella's.....

And yes Horse I did it with my Dremel and didn't screw it up, here is proof. Also remember that this was an ADL.

 

okbow87

Well-known member
Jan 2, 2013
133
0
OKC, OK
I just got a new heavy 223ai spun up and went mdt 10's as well. Non formed brass fed great, but my ai formed dummies were being a little sticky if you didn't run the bolt with some serious authority. Used a file to open the front lips on both side a tiny bit and now both variety feed smooooooth.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
Grab before/after pics on any/all maladies...if only as a future reference.

I gave Nigger Buggy all my AICS poly 10's and ain't seen him in a coupla hours. My guess is,there's been some reinforcements added to their rear halves,to fend THE Split.

He's 6BR'ing the bitches.................
 

Brett

Well-known member
Oct 19, 2013
199
0
OK
I had to open up my MDT 10 rounder as well for formed 223 AI loads.

It fed sammi 223 fine but formed rounds would catch on their wider shoulder as they traveled up the mag. Resulting in a nose-down/ass-up orientation inside the mag.

10 seconds with a dremel, or file, fixes the issue. It now feeds sammi or formed ammo without a hitch.

I also had to notch the rear of the mag so that it would seat against the Vanguard action.

I'll get some pics up this evening.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
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'buggy got a GOOD scald on my AICS 6BR conversion mags,running(2) fasteners along each soine,a goodly distance apart and they are boolitpruff now.

Have not had to love up any MDT poly's,whether SAAMI,AI or 270..................
 

okbow87

Well-known member
Jan 2, 2013
133
0
OKC, OK
Kind of hard to see in the pics, but i just used a file clamped in my vice so that I could match the angle of the flat on the feed lips and flared the front just a bit. The one pic looking straight down you can see the flare and how minuscule it is.

That measurement is right a the end of the feed lip, where it starts to taper down to the mag body. There is a defined line on top of the lip to give you a good reference spot.



 

Brett

Well-known member
Oct 19, 2013
199
0
OK
If you look at the first "rib" in the picture you can see the 1/2" of dremel work down it. Repeat on the opposite side.



Note the notch on the rear of the mag.



 

22 skadoo

Well-known member
Dec 9, 2007
429
10
NJ
Has anyone built a 223AI with a 16" barrel.I would like to go light and short with 8 twist barrel and 75 gr slugs.
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
VA
2.450" still the preferred length to kiss a 75 'max?

Will likely sling more 50s than anything, if that matters.
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
Lineman said:
2.450" still the preferred length to kiss a 75 'max?

Will likely sling more 50s than anything, if that matters.
Yep.

Don't know about the 75 eld yet, but can't figure it'll be too far off.
 

dakotagun

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2017
371
22
Shitsville
I've started a budget 223AI build. 700 action, Remage ordered in a #4 contour 8-twist for 75's and 62's. It's a SS Wilson blank of all things. Finished length 22".

I will run a 6x fixed and it'll rest in a composite sporter stock of some variety. Not real fussy there but it will be classic-ish if not a MCM classic.

It's basically going to be a truck gun with some more ass than my beloved triple deuce.

DBM, ADL, or BDL?
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
Pick your poison...I've done/got 'em all.

75 ELD's across the literal course for me,of course.

Them fuckers is WICKED...............
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
DBM for a truck gun here. PTG just had a sale over the weekend that might be still running. $75
 

JCM

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2013
182
0
I finally got my cherry popped by CDI a couple of months ago on a .223AI sitting in an ADL Manners stock that they changed to DBM...my first. After a couple of months of play, for a truck gun (and fun gun) I think DBM would tough to beat. The feeding is SMOOTH and oal is good.

Haven't lost my love of ADL but do have a new appreciation for DBM.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
DBM's make alotta shit easy and it's often handy to swap out mag capacity,as mood/situation dictates.

I roll 5's on the average in most platforms for Utility,but 10's have their place...............
 

JCM

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2013
182
0
Big Stick said:
DBM's make alotta shit easy and it's often handy to swap out mag capacity,as mood/situation dictates.

I roll 5's on the average in most platforms for Utility,but 10's have their place...............
Picked up 1 5-round mag (Accurate-Mag) and two 10-round mags (MDT). Have only used the MDT's. Need to play with the Accurate-Mag. The ease of sending 10 through without stopping then having 10 sitting on deck kept the steel dancing at a faster pace.

Suggestions on different/better mags (5's or 10's) are welcome as it's all new to me.
 

Rolltide

rimfiretactical.com
Dec 15, 2007
1,206
18
MDT mags have been good to me. Accurate mags work great if I keep pressure on the bottom of the mag. Otherwise, it's useless.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
AM's all run like a top here and is what everyone schleps around as a default. The MDT 10's come out and snick into place,once set up and starting into a 'nanza....................
 

dakotagun

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2017
371
22
Shitsville
[img:left]http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/924/WmHyga.jpg[/img]

DBM and Stock should be here early next week. 75 amax kiss at 2.435" Does that sound about right?
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
dakotagun said:
[img:left]http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/924/WmHyga.jpg[/img]

DBM and Stock should be here early next week. 75 amax kiss at 2.435" Does that sound about right?
That's a nice place to be............
 

dakotagun

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2017
371
22
Shitsville
Finally got this one together. The Wilson tube measures a little tigher than 1 in 8", a good thing. It is also quite smooth but of course it will have to prove itself at the range. I will gun lever and 75's to form and should get to that sometime later this week.

I must say, I am very happy with the DBM setup. I will have more of them on future builds. Also, the Grayboe stock is really damn nice. If you aren't looking for a light weight build, I would recommend giving one of these a try.

[img:left]http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/923/w47SYC.jpg[/img]
 

dakotagun

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2017
371
22
Shitsville
Made a pit stop on my way to work and whistled a few 50 vmax's down the tube to get a zero. Tried to hunker down on the last for a group: .5" triple from edge to edge, leaning on a too tall shooting bench, generic ammo, shit trigger, with my fist as a rear rest.

Yeah, it was probably lucky but I could see good signs when I printed the first couple on paper.

Lever and 75's later today but I gotta get some work done first.

[img:left]http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/320x240q90/924/miQVis.jpg[/img]
[img:left]http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/320x240q90/923/wH0T2N.jpg[/img]
 

dakotagun

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2017
371
22
Shitsville
Lever and 75's scattered for me in both FF and formed cases.

It was a quick range session but multiple charges averaged 1.5". Ran up to 26.5 forming brass and 28.0 in formed stuff. All seemed soft to me. Naked amaxes. How far do I dare go before giving another powder a try?

No pressure signs at all...
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
dakotagun said:
Lever and 75's scattered for me in both FF and formed cases.

It was a quick range session but multiple charges averaged 1.5". Ran up to 26.5 forming brass and 28.0 in formed stuff. All seemed soft to me. Naked amaxes. How far do I dare go before giving another powder a try?

No pressure signs at all...
Well you got 'er hitting on 5 of 8 cylinders.(grin)

Kiss,find pressure and rock on...it never don't not dazzle. Shy of that,you are pissing up ropes in No Man's Land. Tough to cuss a rifle,because it was fed poor ammo.

Hint..........
 

dakotagun

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2017
371
22
Shitsville
Cuando said:
Didn't chrono the first round but just got some data after backing off the loads.

Formed cases:
27.5 lever 2972 average. ES 30
27.8 lever 3078 average. ES 72

FF load:
25.5 lever 2734 average. ES 78

The 27.5 grain load is one I could settle on in formed cases.
Being it's a new tube I suspect I'll gain a little speed and lower ES after I get the round count nearer to 100.

I'd previously shot 28.0, 28.2, 28.5 in formed cases but they shot terrible. I can only estimate speeds on those loads were top-end. At least from my point of view.

I'm gonna roll with the 27.5 grain load for now and bump my FF load up a bit to find more speed and hopefully a better accuracy node.

Any suggestions are appreciated.

Thanks
 

Pat85

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2015
401
2
Pa.
27.8 of lever is where I found the warm and fuzzy. 3175 fps out of its 24"tube. Doesn't get sporty in 90* heat.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
I shoot 75's in Slim Shady(18" BHW Middy Gas) at 2800fps and small change.

I form at 2925fps in 21" 223AI's...............
 

Badley

Active member
Jan 8, 2011
37
0
Oklahoma
What 5rd mags are yall running in the 223 AI? I have only found 10's.

JCM said:
Big Stick said:
DBM's make alotta shit easy and it's often handy to swap out mag capacity,as mood/situation dictates.

I roll 5's on the average in most platforms for Utility,but 10's have their place...............
 

dakotagun

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2017
371
22
Shitsville
Im a slow leaner:
Primer choice had me chasing my tail on my 223ai, 75's, & lever. Rem 7.5's are all I have EVER run and they just didn't jive with the lever above 27.5 grains in formed cases. Accuracy & ES was just terrible at the upper charges.

I had a brick of 400's in the cabinet so gave them a go. 27.8 & 28.0 grains of lever both shot better than good. Will chrono in the AM and run with the CCI's.
 

dakotagun

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2017
371
22
Shitsville
Noted.

I should mention this in the original lever thread as I saw there was someone else who was having shit ES numbers when approaching the sweet spot in a SAAMI 223. Had I taken better notes in the first place I'd have had some kills with this bastard by now.

Can't say I've ever been fucked by a 7.5, until yesterday...
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
Nice to shoot shit side by each...because them findings,tend to stick in The Memory Bank.

Seen it...................(grin)
 

bobnob

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2016
566
4
NSW, Australia
FWIW (not much) I've gone to BR4 primers for everything small primer. It's working well and I can't see ever going elsewhere.
 

Badley

Active member
Jan 8, 2011
37
0
Oklahoma
My Rifle returned from CDI last week. Had time to get every thing back together yesterday. Went out to check Cows and found I was not the only one checking them out.



I really like the DM setup. No more feeding issues. Thanks for helping me find my way.



 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
VA
What type of mag and what’s the max COAL?
Been thinking about DBM on my next build, but don’t know much about them at all.
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
VA
Fire-forming isn't showing me much love in the accuracy department.

25 grains of Varget behind a 75 ELD shot crazy good, everything else was frustrating.

1.25-2.25" being the norm for 5 shot groups working with '335. Went for way low to higher than I thought I could go, no joy. That was with 50 Vmax, 65 Gameking and 75 ELD.

Hoping a few more rounds down the tube and she'll tighten up. Have had a couple barrels take several. Had high hopes for this PN, hoping it won't be finicky.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
I'd check mechanics and that all was well. Noooooooooooooo fucking way a rifle(223AI) that is tight and right,will bughole Vargay and go Improved Cylinder with '335.

Sumptin' changed and it ain't powder...............(grin)
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
VA
I was thinking same.

Went from 23.5 to 27 with 50s, RP virgins, 400s and 450s. No moly.

23–26.5 with 65s and 23-26 with 75s.

All look like shit. Big round groups no apparent string one way or the other.
 

16Bore

Well-known member
Feb 11, 2010
3,272
1
Virgina
How would rifle mechanics effect one powder but not another? Or are you saying that something went amiss between loading the Varget lot and the 335 lot?
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
16Bore said:
How would rifle mechanics effect one powder but not another? Or are you saying that something went amiss between loading the Varget lot and the 335 lot?
Powder ain't Mechanical...it's Alchemy.

Certainly,something mechanical is amiss and the propellant has zero bearing in that regard....................
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
LOTSA horizontal there,which screams "bedding",amongst other things. All groups are wider,than they are tall and the rifle is talking to you.

Happiness is round groups.

Hint....................
 

16Bore

Well-known member
Feb 11, 2010
3,272
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So then a tight rifle is going to "group" best based on SD, regardless of what's pushing the bullet. Varget, 335, baby powder....

Reckon I don't get the " my rifle doesn't like "brand X" " powder jargon...
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
Got this one back from a buddy that Cerakoted it for me. Came out awesome!

700
.223AI
PN Mag sporter 1-8" 3 groove @ 21 inches
McM Hunter
PTG Stealth with 5 rd AM's
DD's
6x MQ
805 trigger
 

Big Stick

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16Bore said:
So then a tight rifle is going to "group" best based on SD, regardless of what's pushing the bullet. Varget, 335, baby powder....

Reckon I don't get the " my rifle doesn't like "brand X" " powder jargon...
It's ALL about connecting dots.

Correct mechanical assembly,in happy bedding,squirting straight Smooches that are consistent in velocity...ain't gonna yield the above weirdness. Ever.

The way a powder meters,fends temps,lot to lot consistency,density and burn rate,are what I base a selection offa.

Was ordering powder yesterday and passed up a screaming deal on 8lb VarGay,mainly because I hate the shit and it's never showed me nothin'.

Which ain't because I've never not shot it,in more than a few splendid blueprints. '15 is KING in the burning rate and if/when talking 223AI and 8" RPM,I'd just as soon be gunning Lever',over anything. Why? Burn rate,metering,density and consistency,which conjoin to arrange trite ES/SD values,at rather meaningful velocities.

That in turn bolts and Krunchentickers.................
 

Big Stick

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Tough to beat a simplistic ruggedly/reliable blueprint,that handles/balances nicely.

You are there...............
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
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Mine's a tad slimmer than yours.

I went with PN #1 3 groove 1 in 8" @ 21" in a Hunter's Edge.
6.5 lbs with no scope.

I'm kissing ELD's at 2.435, tad shorter than I wanted but not worried. Slid the mag shim and she's feeding slick as shit. Lower rings enroute, waiting on UPS to inspect the stock before I send it back to McMillan.

Think I'll love the rig if it proves to be a shooter. Think it's the only M70 in this thread...

 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
Nice!

2.432" here.

The chin weld on the Hunters Edge kinda drove me nuts.

Might have to post pics of my old worn out .223AI M70 Coyote. 10,000+ rounds and it's still shooting under 3 inches.... barely.
 

TXNative

Well-known member
Jan 27, 2013
298
0
I shot a lot of Varget in 308 and used it for heavy 223 and stocked up, sold the 308 and fed the 223's MR2000 but recently gave Lever another chance and the Montana prefers it to MR. A local guy bought the 5lbs of Varget and I replaced it with 8lbs of Lever.

The powder deals are out there if you order more than a pound, 8lbs is not bad but 54lbs is damn cheap if you have a buddy or two that needs to restock. I think our last order average 18.30/lb to the door.
 

Big Stick

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I've never seen Varget do anything for speed or consistency,in any chambering.

Powder sourced locally,is close to $40 a pound...............
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
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After a few rounds, it’s tightening up considerably.

Think it’s going down the road though, soon as I get the stock fixed or replaced.
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
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Nothing in particular, just nothing about it that would ever make me carry it over my old .243.

So I’ll just take the monetary loss and move on. I ain’t much into having stuff I don’t use.

I think I had my hopes too high that it would be “the” rifle for all around Utility, but I just don’t like it as much and I hoped.

I’ll take the cash and build something a little chunkier, keep carrying the bold beater for everyday use.
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
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Kinda like my K Hornet...

I love them "on paper" if that makes sense, but in the real world I just don't see myself carrying them much.
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
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I can’t get past .243....

Does it all for me, and easily.

It takes quite a bit of convincing and impressing me to stray from what has worked for years.

I’d love to buy or build a rifle and have my mind blown, but it never seems to happen. Kinda is a shitter being disappointed most of the time.

Been the same way with guitars too, I’ve a Mexican tele that I can’t get rid of. I’ve had/played plenty of USA made Fenders, Gibson’s, PRS etc....but I just keep coming back.

I guess I like simple shit that I can just grab and go. No fuckin around, no finicky shit just doing what I need time and time again no matter what I throw at them.

Maybe I’m just weird, and it surely ain’t cause the bar is too fucking high. I’ll keep looking for The One, but I’m starting to think it’s going to cost me a hell of a lot more money than it’s worth.
 

Big Stick

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I'd wayyyyyyyyyyyy rather shoot a High RPM 223AI day in/day out,rather than a 243Win Salami or 243Win AI. Or a 6 Kreedmire,or a 6mmRem Salami,or a 6mm Rem AI. Or a 6-284 or 6 Twat-Six.(grin)

Start talkin' 270,6 Grendel or 6BR and you'll gain traction on me.

I was soooooooooo fucking hot yesterday with Fire Form 50's at 3350fps in theBMFOTP...that the only guy who would believe,was the one watching me do it.

And I fucking HATE 50's.................(grin)
 

Big Stick

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Should add...it's lookin' to be Kluge Franken Huge 7-08 build party this evening...just gotsta find my stash of beeg lugs.

Loadin' 7 Whizzum 180 ELD's now..................(grin)
 

Big Stick

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Nov 18, 2007
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16Bore said:
Or go 19" 6x45...
Loaded a couple/few hunnert 18" 270 105's last night and found a stash of loaded 19" 270 105's...which weren't bad news.

The 19" 7" RPM Bart' 270,makes folks look good,without even trying.

Though the 18" Montucky 270 is THE greatest Mind Fuck of all,especially with the Illuminatti at 1200yds++....................
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
VA
Big Stick said:
I'd wayyyyyyyyyyyy rather shoot a High RPM 223AI day in/day out,rather than a 243Win Salami or 243Win AI. Or a 6 Kreedmire,or a 6mmRem Salami,or a 6mm Rem AI. Or a 6-284 or 6 Twat-Six.(grin)
I keep trying to convince myself that I would too, but every time I try...nope.

Wish I were closer, I'd give you a chance to change my mind.

I'll fuck with this one for a month or so, and see if it grows on me.
 

16Bore

Well-known member
Feb 11, 2010
3,272
1
Virgina
You want a grab and go 223, go 1:8 Tikka. That's where I ended up after going down the 223AI and 6x45 rabbit hole.
 

Dude270

Well-known member
Dec 23, 2014
971
73
Lineman

Sorry to hear that the 223 AI isn't what you hoped. It's interesting because we are pretty much in the same kind of country and for me, my 223 AI would be the last rifle I'd give up.
 

Big Stick

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Nov 18, 2007
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16Bore said:
You want a grab and go 223, go 1:8 Tikka. That's where I ended up after going down the 223AI and 6x45 rabbit hole.
Tikka fucks up magazines,like few others and bullets still seem to matter.(grin)

75 ELD Smooches at 3100fps +,assuredly do not suck on a .378" boltface. Hell...I've seen it.

A High RPM 270,just reliably does shit that can't be did,even if you try to tell it that it cain't. Lotsas folks have tried,but nobody can reduce the Mojo,despite valiant efforts.

I happily shoot the fuck outta them all,in blind mags,with Smooches a Tikka can only DREAM about and just might have some mag fed versions,that do same. Plum handy,schlepping all along in R&D,if only for Dissenters,who always get the first shot.

It just don't never go their way and everyone cuts checks after the fact...............(grin)
 

Big Stick

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Dude270 said:
Lineman

Sorry to hear that the 223 AI isn't what you hoped. It's interesting because we are pretty much in the same kind of country and for me, my 223 AI would be the last rifle I'd give up.
Purty sweet on the chambering myself.(grin)

Got a right proper Metalfication Fuck Show going on now,as the 'lug needed is .220" and all I had was .244" 's and .250" 's. Will set up snuggerly Virgin headspace upn sized cases,drop in a DBM,inlet the front receiver ring for binderless 162/80 ELD Smooches and slam a 10x MQ on top.

Gutted my 6.5 Twat-Six's lug,to lay things in action...but was in Virgin Transition anywhoo and am cool driving an OEM S/S lug,with spout headspaced to arrange same. Had good Glue on the Marty 45MOA extended 1913 rail and was thinking I was heading 8-40.(grin)

16x MQ got peeled offa the BMFOTP,10x went on instead and there will be a fair amount of shooting in the morning.

Funny shit!..................
 

16Bore

Well-known member
Feb 11, 2010
3,272
1
Virgina
The one factory 6 rounder I opened up for 75's, but will see how these shake out.

https://tikkaperformance.com/index.php?_route_=mountain-tactical-company/tikka-billet-magazine
 

Big Stick

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Nov 18, 2007
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I know those mags have benn bait on the hook,for a goodly while.

Converted a pard's TikTac mag in 223,when those rifles were first offered and they are phony fucking pieces of shit...but it would Smooch/Feed 75 'Max. He tripped it and went 700,which what I told him,before he cut the check and started pissing up ropes.

Hell,RAR 223 mags are better than Tikka's feeble attempt....................
 

16Bore

Well-known member
Feb 11, 2010
3,272
1
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OEM ain't much for sure. There's some Aussie stuff that's quite costly. CTR might be something. Dunno...
 

Big Stick

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Nov 18, 2007
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Cain't speak to Down Under Mags...but all of the CTR shit sucks heavy ass,just like the rest of the Tikka OEM attempts...................
 

dakotagun

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2017
371
22
Shitsville
If Tikka would just make a S+ length mag like they did with the "M+" on the kreedmires, we would at least have something to work with.

Tikka does a lot of things right. It's a shame to have a decent stock, barrel, & trigger on a lightweight rifle, for a decent price, and throw that all out the window by running a restricted length mag.

They will probably increase the magazine to 2.550" or so and simultaneously offer only 12" twist barrels--again. No shit, I wouldn't be surprised...
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
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That'd be an easy fix and on their "TikTac" bullshit,just simply go AICS footprint mags and quit fucking around,with proprietary worthless junk that's gold plated.

Funnier than fuck,to offer a 223 on a 30-06 receiver and it'll only digest AR-15 COAL............(grin)
 

Big Stick

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Nov 18, 2007
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Criterion is headed that way,but I'd want a REAL recoil lug...but then a guy is grinding on a Milk Jug and still up Shit Creek with magazines.............
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
VA
Dude270 said:
Lineman

Sorry to hear that the 223 AI isn't what you hoped. It's interesting because we are pretty much in the same kind of country and for me, my 223 AI would be the last rifle I'd give up.
I hear that a lot, I'm going to give this one a little more time, see what happens.
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
VA
Just found more Amaxes, so I’ll run them out before going to the 105 HPBT.

Running them at 2950 in both my rifles at the moment.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
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223AI/75ELD at 3150fps 200yd zero:

300yds 5.8" drop / 5.8" drift / 2540fps
500yds 34.4" drop / 17.3" drift / 2170fps
700yds 93" drop / 37" drift / 1830fps
1000yds 265" drop / 87" drift / 1372fps

243Win/105 'Max Litz at 2950fps 200yd zero:

300yds 6.6" drop / 5.8" drift / 2408fps
500yds 38.8" drop / 17.3" drift / 2077fps
700yds 103" drop / 37" drift / 1773fps
1000yds 290" drop / 85" drift / 1357fps

No in fairness...one burns a "little bit" less powder,holds more in the mag,ain't as loud and bucks less.

Seen it...................(grin)
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
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Should add that a 20" 22 Grendel 1-8" Rifle Gas Krunchenticker,just happens to scoot the 75ELD at like speed,which is both familiar and "comfy" territory.

Hint..................(grin)
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
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Let me get the fucker going bang every time I pull the trigger and shooting they way I want, then we’ll talk #s
 

Big Stick

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Nov 18, 2007
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MUCH to be said,for Starting At The Fucking Start.

Been doing it,since 4:00AM this morning and am on a rather good fucking roll.................(grin)
 

Dude270

Well-known member
Dec 23, 2014
971
73
You get that rifle doing it's thing and I'd be surprised if the 243 doesn't stay home til deer season. Like stick pointed out, drop and drift are pretty much the same but I enjoy less report and recoil and more rounds downrange before scalding hot
 

Dude270

Well-known member
Dec 23, 2014
971
73
I've thought about getting mine rebadged 6x45 so I didn't have to be as careful where I deer hunt with it.
 

Big Stick

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Ran (3) Herd Clips through the BMFOTP the other day,as fast as I could(which ain't slow) and it weren't even Luke Warm.

Funny shit!.....................
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
VA
Dude270 said:
I've thought about getting mine rebadged 6x45 so I didn't have to be as careful where I deer hunt with it.
I've not had good luck with our local wardens...so I try and keep my shit in line.

I think me and this rifle got off on the wrong foot. I had a good streak going of getting shit that everything was warm/fuzzy out of the gate and my last couple have been anything but. Guess I was thinking this one would be ready to go since I had it put together by a well known/praised 'smith.

Still might be, and it's me that's the shitty link, don't know. But I'll find out soon. Thinking headspace is a little loose(haven't measured but there's no feeling chambering a virgin)about 10% light strike, had to address mag box issues, extraction could be better, and the randomness of the shitty groups has me scratching my head big time.
 

Big Stick

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In no particular order,positive headspace will greatly aid Feed,Function,Reliability,Accuracy,Precision and ES/SD.

Always KNOW what headspace is doing to you,with both Virgins and Formed Cases...or you very well might could get fucking hurt,as a minimum. 'Course,things won't/cain't shoot for fuck either.

Tapered expander balls and false shoulders,will reliably connect ALOTTA fucking dots.

Seen it.................(grin)
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
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Any way of knowing without gauges?

FWIW, the tape thing never did work that well for me.

Smith claims he set up headspace to have a slight crush, said bolt barely closed on go gauge...
 

Big Stick

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Open the PM and call me.(grin)

Fuck gauges...and fuck everything else,EXCEPT the very components YOU are using..............
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
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Don’t have rifle in hand at the moment, headed with the kid to a volleyball game.

Maybe tomorrow evening...if you’re free
 

Big Stick

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Nov 18, 2007
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I can only lead folks to water...I cain't make 'em drink it.

Nor would I,even if I could..............(grin)
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
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You tell me what to have on hand, we’re in the middle of a remodel, shits strung about the house from one end to the other.
 

Big Stick

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Nothing to it...as It can go no other way.

Spill your guts,when the stars align and the warm/fuzzy is ignited..............
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
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Headspace crossed off the list.



No misfires today.

First three shots made me happy, after that things weren't looking so good. Better than before...so we're moving in the right direction.

This is false shouldered virgin R/P, 26.5 H335, 50 Vmax lightly in lands.



 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
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Took it apart, checked all fasteners, changed rings/scope just to be sure.

Lever sure didn't look any better...

Bedding next?



 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
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16Bore said:
I like PF's but the AI ship done sailed. You got an action screw hitting the bolt head?
Nope, front screw was shortened to give plenty of clearance.
 

16Bore

Well-known member
Feb 11, 2010
3,272
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Talk about March Madness. I'd shoot some factory shit just to see what the fuck...I've got a pretty piss poor track record loading 223AI, as you can see from my pic.
 

Big Stick

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I've always enjoyed the fun,of sorting a rifle out.

Am thinking,that your approach as per our talk yesterday,will sort things out............
 

dakotagun

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2017
371
22
Shitsville
Don't know where you're at with this, but I experienced something of note loading for a couple different AI's pretty recently.

First, Rem 7.5 primers sucked with my lever loads. Switching to CCI 400's made a big difference in accuracy and ES.

My production barrel(wilson) 223AI ate 27.8-28.0 lever and naked 75 ELDs. My Mullerworks tube likes 27.0-27.3 with same.

Don't know if its the chamber or the tube. I cut the Muller chamber with a Manson reamer and it does seem a little less generous than whatever reamer cut the chamber on the Wilson barrel. Also, the Wilson tube didn't display the velocity with 75's that everyone else was getting, though it was plenty good at 3,060 fps. Both tubes are 22" and shoot very well.

Will get speed on the Mullerworks load tonight for comparison. I won't be surprised if it equals or exceeds the 3,060 of the Wilson barrel with the higher powder charge.
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
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Still haven’t had it back out.

Been a rough month around here, lost several friends and family members. Seems like I’ve spent more time at hospitals and funeral homes than anywhere else.

Appreciate the info.
 

Lineman

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2010
1,148
33
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Seems things are settling down, I appreciate it.

Makes a man step back and look at things when people your age start falling out....
 

Pat85

Well-known member
Mar 8, 2015
401
2
Pa.
If some one would have told me I would have been busting bottles at 850 yards with this setup I would have replied they were nuts! 223 AI with75 gr Amax propelled with 27.8 grs. lever.



Have more fun with this rifle than a guy my age should be allowed to have. :)
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
Anybody else looking at those 88's and thinking 1-7" .223AI?

I'm thinking Remage Criterion sub 20".

2700 fps ish? Maybe?
 

dznnf7

Well-known member
Apr 30, 2016
600
27
That'd be a fun one to shoot high-volume with. Free brass, no recoil and a killer bullet would be a lot of fun. I'm interested in a Fieldcraft or Montana in the non-existent 22 CM. I could build one, but I'd rather buy it. And for some reason the Valkyrie just pisses me off.
 

Big Stick

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Nov 18, 2007
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Waiting on a 22 CM spout now and if I can get a line on some 88's,they'll be headed my way.

A 223AI will scoot 90's better than 2700fps.................
 

Badley

Active member
Jan 8, 2011
37
0
Oklahoma
Smith called and is fixing to chamber my 223 Ackley. Brux #3 at 21. Cant decide if I should have it threaded or not? I want to go suppressed but don't like the idea of 27 inches of barrel.
 

Big Stick

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Nov 18, 2007
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That's on you to decide.

If a Can was on the menu,I'd be at 16.25" and dedicated to the pursuit.

Otherwise it'd be 21"...............
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/dept/reloading/rifle-bullets/-point-224-dia/88-gr
 

Big Stick

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Have 500 myself.

Will try 'em in 7",7.5" and 7.7's...to see WTF.

223,223AI,22-250,22-250AI and Kreedmire..................
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
I wanna know what COAL a guy has to be at and if you could find joy with both 75's and 88's in a .223AI.
 

Big Stick

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Nov 18, 2007
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Why wouldn't a guy try? It's a $20 Entry Fee,to KNOW.

Everyone has a more forgiving atmosphere and altitude,than I do...and I'm gonna be trying too...............(grin)
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
Broke down and have a 21" 1-7" Shilen small shank Rem. Varmint in the works.

Waiting on 88's and will send dummies when they get here.

So much for the 6x45...
 

Cuando

Well-known member
Oct 23, 2014
887
9
Thanks for the offer. Got a few hunnert headed my way from Midsouth with plenty of time to get stuff figured.

Awful nice of you though.
 

Dude270

Well-known member
Dec 23, 2014
971
73
No worries. If I had a 7 or 7.5 twist on my bolt guns I would have gotten some more but I'm skeptical of seeing round holes in the paper. Much less good groups
 

Big Stick

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I wanna say 1.241"...but have yet to measure my own.

Copper Creek says the Factory 22 Kreedmire ammo they load,makes 3350fps with a 88 and that'll do some thangs...............(grin)
 

Badley

Active member
Jan 8, 2011
37
0
Oklahoma
Haven't found anything warm and fuzzy yet. Temp and dad obligations have not afforded me much quality time to develop a good load yet.
 

Badley

Active member
Jan 8, 2011
37
0
Oklahoma
Had some free time this afternoon. Since I moved, I Can not find my Chronograph.



Fireforming - 6 shot group of 75gr bthp 28gr Lever



26gr Lever 75gr BTHP

I have not been able to get the ELD's to shoot yet.
 

Dude270

Well-known member
Dec 23, 2014
971
73
Looking good.
I shoot 26.5 grains of lever when forming and 28.0 in formed cases. I'm still shooting amaxs as I have a boat load of them
 

30338

Well-known member
Apr 3, 2010
576
48
75 amaxs owned the prairie yesterday again. Tough day to be a prairie dog. 223ai is too much fun.
 

Big Stick

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Nov 18, 2007
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Was talking to a guy yesterday and he was talking about how 223's sucked,with 55 FMJ's,which prolly is a fact. Then I touched upon 75 ELD's at 2900fps and showed him my DOPE and it floored him.

Boolits do tend to matter and the 223AI easily remains my favorite chambering of All Time..............
 

12ozkurl

Well-known member
Apr 25, 2015
70
0
I took one of my 223AI to the 300 yard range yesterday. It is only a 1-12 twist so I shoot 50gr NBT's and they are freaking accurate. Going to work up a dope and take it to 600 if I can.
 

bobnob

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2016
566
4
NSW, Australia
How about some advice re loads?

Have just had delivered a Howa 1500 223AI. It’s the standard 1-9 twist so its 75g Hdy BTHPs all the way at this stage.

I can’t get ‘Lever. Alliant powders are hard to get. It’s the ADI powders or not much at all.

To that end I have H4895, Varget, H322 or 8208.

Have any of you blokes worked up loads with 75s with these powders?

I’m fire forming 75g BTHPs with 25.5g of H4895. Making 2920fps in the 20.5” bbl.

I need the advice if you have some. Thanks.
 

bobnob

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2016
566
4
NSW, Australia
Also add this query...

I’d be delighted with 3000fps with the 75 BTHP from the 20.5” bbl. Achievable with the likes of H4895 or 8208?
 

Big Stick

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H4895 would be my choice,as I've used it in said application and what you wish for velocity wise,is very easily arranged.

Load density will be compressed and that tends to help ES/SD on the average..................
 

dznnf7

Well-known member
Apr 30, 2016
600
27
Limited like you are, I'd keep this handy. It's not the whole story but it's a good start.

https://www.hodgdon.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/burn-rate-color.pdf
 

bobnob

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2016
566
4
NSW, Australia
Yep seems 8208 and 4895 are very close. I’ll report back. H4895 will be the first pitch given FF loads are running 0.75moa with the 75g Hornady. I’ve got some Nosler 70g RDFs. Initial results with 4895 have not been encouraging at all. I’ll give them a try with the 8208 and see how they go.
 

bobnob

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2016
566
4
NSW, Australia
Big Stick said:
The RDF's are Dog Shit.

In a 9"...the 75 Hornie HPBT has no equal...........
On the little evidence I’ve seen I’m not prepared to dispute the first point.
And couldn’t agree more on the second.
At any rate I’ll shoot the few RDFs I have left and see what the.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
I gave the RDF's a better than fair shake,in both .224" and .243" and they are simply absolute fucking Dog Shit.

R&D is half the fun and sweetens the pot,to refresh how mainstays shine brightly..............
 

bobnob

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2016
566
4
NSW, Australia
Just confirmed same - as if that was needed. 2 groups at 125y. First group was 0.46”... WOOHOO. Second was 2.54”... WOOPOO.

The remaining from the pack can be used for culling under a spotlight I think.

Back to the BTHP and in bulk!
 

bobnob

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2016
566
4
NSW, Australia
May as well post this just for the sake of sharing data...

223AI
20.5” bbl (9” twist Howa S2)
70RDF
FC17 brass
26.0g 8208
BR4
3.32” oal (yet to take the spacer out of the mag but the RDF still shot crap loaded to the lands and single fed)
Ave 3045fps
 

bobnob

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2016
566
4
NSW, Australia
Final working load worked up in formed brass:

25.8g of H4895 / BR4 / 75g Hdy BTHP - 2995fps (20.5” bbl)

Nice and accurate... Bugger the RDF!!!
 

bobnob

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2016
566
4
NSW, Australia
Truth be known 2950fps would be enough for my purposes Salami or AI. Mainly foxes and other pests out to 350y and hitting steel out to about 750.

Rifle's shooting nice at around 3000... appreciate the pointers!
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
When the dust settles,consistency is key and it's ALL about the warm/fuzzy.

That's alotta performance at your fingertips,which will reliably cover ALOTTA bases.

Seen it!...............(grin)
 

LOBO

Well-known member
Dec 9, 2007
256
0
Mississippi
Big Stick said:
In my last 21" NSS,I shoot the 75 ELD at 2950fps ala Lever' in a SALAMI chamber..............
What is a good start point with Lever & the 75 ELD in a .223 SALAMI? FWIW, the 75 A-Max touches the lands at 2.395" in my gun.
 

Big Stick

Well-known member
Nov 18, 2007
42,650
465
Paradise
25.0grs is a soft start,with any brass,in 7",7.5" and 8" RPM 223 SALAMI spouts...even with a throat that short.............